Sam Tomkins

[Rooster_6]

Forwards are different to backs in the sense that you can be a ponderous forward who can play 35-45 minutes and get away with it but a back who has to be there for the full game can't hide on the bench.

Compare Gareth Ellis to Gareth Widdop.

What are you talking about? Ellis and Burgess both play 60+ minutes and it's not uncommon for them to play the full 80. I dare say Graham will be play 60 minutes a game too which is massive for a prop.

Widdop is different to what we're talking about a lot of his education and development was done here in Australia.

What did Tomkins show at international level this year or last year that suggests he'd struggle in the NRL? He tore the Australian's and New Zealand's defence apart.

[Guest]

What are you talking about? Ellis and Burgess both play 60+ minutes and it's not uncommon for them to play the full 80. I dare say Graham will be play 60 minutes a game too which is massive for a prop.

Widdop is different to what we're talking about a lot of his education and development was done here in Australia.

What did Tomkins show at international level this year or last year that suggests he'd struggle in the NRL? He tore the Australian's and New Zealand's defence apart.

I can't change your mind so I'm moving on from this conversation.

[Guest]

Forwards are different to backs in the sense that you can be a ponderous forward who can play 35-45 minutes and get away with it but a back who has to be there for the full game can't hide on the bench.

Compare Gareth Ellis to Gareth Widdop.

Exactly the forwards will do well. How many quality halves and backs have England produced in the last 15 years? Rangi Chase a reserve grader here was their best player. If he came for $200k I would be happy but he isn't a proven elite player.

I mean look at the depth in the position in the NRL Hoffman, Bowen, Gidley, Boyd, Slater, Dugan, Hayne, Gardner, Barba, Locke, Stewart, Coote, Gordon and Merrett. I would take anyone of those players before Tomkins.

Also there are good young kids that come through every year. We don't need to sign some bloke from England there are enough good players here.

[Guest]

Exactly the forwards will do well. How many quality halves and backs have England produced in the last 15 years? Rangi Chase a reserve grader here was their best player. If he came for $200k I would be happy but he isn't a proven elite player.

I mean look at the depth in the position in the NRL Hoffman, Bowen, Gidley, Boyd, Slater, Dugan, Hayne, Gardner, Barba, Locke, Stewart, Coote, Gordon and Merrett. I would take anyone of those players before Tomkins.

Also there are good young kids that come through every year. We don't need to sign some bloke from England there are enough good players here.

Yet again, you explain it succinctly where I cannot. Thank you.

[Guest]

He is playing for the Barbarians against the Wannabies. LOL. He will probably get smashed and thrown around, he needs to do more weights. Too Small

[Rooster_6]

Exactly the forwards will do well. How many quality halves and backs have England produced in the last 15 years? Rangi Chase a reserve grader here was their best player. If he came for $200k I would be happy but he isn't a proven elite player.

Chase was not their best player, not only did he fail to show any sort of directional or organisational skills but he missed 8 out of 24 attempted tackles. For a half he touched the ball 25 times, that's woeful. He's an overrated running 5/8 who is much better suited to the pace of the super league than he ever was NRL.

I mean look at the depth in the position in the NRL Hoffman, Bowen, Gidley, Boyd, Slater, Dugan, Hayne, Gardner, Barba, Locke, Stewart, Coote, Gordon and Merrett. I would take anyone of those players before Tomkins.

Of those players Gidley(as a bench utility), Slater, Hayne & Stewart are "proven elite athletes". Bowen was once but like Mini his best days are beyond him although he still goes good and Dugan will surely need more than 1 good performance at SOO level to prove it if you're dismissing Tomkins two superior performances this year against Australia & New Zealand.

So of those players to fill the five-eight/fullback role you can narrow it down to two Hayne who would command 600k+ or Gidley a 29 year old utility coming towards the end of his career. I'd disagree that the role of a proven elite player with great creative skills carries as much depth as you think.

Also there are good young kids that come through every year. We don't need to sign some bloke from England there are enough good players here.

Like who? The two best 5/8's in recent times have been Widdop and Foran... a kiwi and a pom. The last decent 5/8 Australia unearthed was ironically Jamie Soward who debuted back in 2005, although even despite his good performances in origin this year I don't rate him as really great 5/8 anyway. If it's not a local junior then I don't see why prejudice should be held against someone's nationality.

[Rooster_6]

Just got selected to play for the Barbarians against the Wallabies.

[Guest]

I think its ignorant for anyone to say a Super League player wont make it in the NRL. Obviously the NRL is a tougher comp, but there are some really good players in the SL!!!

Although he would be a good buy, hopefully we stick with our young kids!!!

[chook 56]

There are a few in the SL that would make it here.
The biggest difference, talking to a couple of ex players that went over there, is the fitness & training attitude. They are 30 years behind, so when they get out here & see what is considered "normal" (throw in the heat as well) & most fold under the demands.
Get someone with the right attitude, like Morls, and it will happen.

[Guest]

There are a few in the SL that would make it here.
The biggest difference, talking to a couple of ex players that went over there, is the fitness & training attitude. They are 30 years behind, so when they get out here & see what is considered "normal" (throw in the heat as well) & most fold under the demands.
Get someone with the right attitude, like Morls, and it will happen.

and most NRL teams are still 5 years behind the fitness of a team like the storm.

[Guest]

I think its ignorant for anyone to say a Super League player wont make it in the NRL.

I agree.

Gareth Ellis is just about the best forward in the NRL.

So is Sam Burgess.

And Morley was the best forward in the NRL.

[Chook Norris]

they've proven to breed good forwards

England's backline is pretty stock standard average though apart from one or two