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  • Originally posted by MKCS View Post

    Bit harsh I think.

    At the Warriors he went to the finals 4/6 times including a preliminary final and a grand final appearance. He was shit at the Tigers but who hasn't been? You could easily chalk that up to poor ownership of the team and not the coach.

    He actually was pretty shit in his first run at Penrith only managing one finals appearance in 4 seasons. Has more than made up for it now though with the 4 grand final wins though I reckon
    Just proves it’s less about the ability of the coach and more about the ability of the team.

    Even the good coaches like Ivan without the right team won’t get results.

    Comment


    • Penrith are riding the wave of success which can sometimes happen in a team sport where one team can dominate the comp for a period of time and take out the silverware year after year - The Dragons won a 11 in a row for instance.

      Of course people will want their team to be more competitive against such teams so it is not only up to the coaches but also the players as well to be better.

      Sometimes or most times it seemed that Penritth had their opponent beaten before they even took the field.

      That can happen in Individual sports as well i.e Rafa Nadel at Roland Garros (French Open) - 14 of his 21 grand slams were won at Roland Garros

      Comment


      • Originally posted by HunchoRooster View Post

        4 comps. He's turned average players into multi time premiership winners. Lost countless talent and replaced them seamlessly. I don't like the bloke but far out you need to give him credit and he has owned Trent for many years now coaching wise.
        Is it him or the system that he inherited though? It took him 15 years to win anything so if he's such a coaching guru why was he not successful anywhere else? He had one good year at the Warriors where they made a GF but prior to parachuting into the empire that Gus built he did nothing

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Rooster1908 View Post

          4 premierships in a row and your don't want Cleary .FMD you are a hard judge
          I don't want Ivan, I want the system he inherited. Give me Bellamy over Ivan any day.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by King Salvo View Post
            Penrith are riding the wave of success which can sometimes happen in a team sport where one team can dominate the comp for a period of time and take out the silverware year after year - The Dragons won a 11 in a row for instance.

            Of course people will want their team to be more competitive against such teams so it is not only up to the coaches but also the players as well to be better.

            Sometimes or most times it seemed that Penritth had their opponent beaten before they even took the field.

            That can happen in Individual sports as well i.e Rafa Nadel at Roland Garros (French Open) - 14 of his 21 grand slams were won at Roland Garros
            Can't compare the Dragons 11 in a row to the professionalism of this NRL era.

            Everyone now days has acess to the advancement in modern science/sport.

            In this salary cap era its much more of an even playing field, there really shouldn't be dynasties like this Panthers team has.

            It cant be that Storm/Panthers have better players as they lose a ton of them & are still a step ahead.

            Continued success = who's running the ship, people who know how to adapt & know how to change what's not working. People who's message doesn't get old.

            Robbo isn't one of those people anymore.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Rooster_6 View Post

              Just proves it’s less about the ability of the coach and more about the ability of the team.

              Even the good coaches like Ivan without the right team won’t get results.
              That's just passing the buck on the person who's job it is to get the best out of them & Improve any deficiencies.

              The way you word it is like an under dog or battler has never come good or had success.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Eggspert View Post

                That's just passing the buck on the person who's job it is to get the best out of them & Improve any deficiencies.

                The way you word it is like an under dog or battler has never come good or had success.
                It's nothing to do with passing the buck and everything to do with being proportionate when assessing the coaches role and impact.

                I'm not saying a coach has zero impact but the significance some are putting on the coaches role is grossly over-stated. Ivan Cleary is the perfect example of that, a very good coach who when given the right environment to succeed did so but also struggled for most of the years prior to that.

                I just think it's too simplistic to judge a coach solely on their results, I'd rather judge them on the evidence of their actions.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by King Salvo View Post

                  Sandon Smith 100% - done his time through the pathways from Andrew Johns Cup through to NRL - 30 NRL games so his best footy is in front of him. -2021 Sandon was SG Ball Best and Fairest and Sydney Roosters Junior Representative Player of the Year.

                  Not sure why people are advocating for the signing of Brown as the Roosters will end up losing Sandon Smith / Toby Rodwell/Jake Elliot/Reece Foley/Hugo Savala for instance as why would they stay - Sam Walker is no guarantee to re-sign again when his current contract expires in 2027.

                  Have to start from scratch again in developing a new batch of halves if that occurred- going to be a challenge as it is keeping halves if the Sandon Smith/Sam Walker combo clicks as they would seen as a long term halves combo.
                  • ​​Dylan Brown is 25 in 2025
                  • Sam Walker is 23 in 2025
                  • Sandon Smith is 22 in 2025
                  • Jake Elliot is 20 in 2025
                  • Hugo Savala is 23 in 2025
                  • Toby Rodwell is 18 or so in 2025
                  • Reece Foley is 20 in 2025
                  Well I'm not surprised as you think Hutch is a freak.

                  How will you feel if we sign Brown?

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Rooster_6 View Post

                    It's nothing to do with passing the buck and everything to do with being proportionate when assessing the coaches role and impact.

                    I'm not saying a coach has zero impact but the significance some are putting on the coaches role is grossly over-stated. Ivan Cleary is the perfect example of that, a very good coach who when given the right environment to succeed did so but also struggled for most of the years prior to that.

                    I just think it's too simplistic to judge a coach solely on their results, I'd rather judge them on the evidence of their actions.
                    The coaches role is definitely not overstated.

                    The last 3yrs or so we've largely kept the same team while Penrith/Melbourne have lost really good talent but continue to be streets ahead of the rest. Did the players do that themselves?

                    Tell me...why can Bellamy & Cleary the last 5yrs beat the Roosters 23 times out of 24 but Robbo can do it once?

                    You reckon coaching has anything to do with it?

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Eggspert View Post

                      Can't compare the Dragons 11 in a row to the professionalism of this NRL era.

                      Everyone now days has acess to the advancement in modern science/sport.

                      In this salary cap era its much more of an even playing field, there really shouldn't be dynasties like this Panthers team has.

                      It cant be that Storm/Panthers have better players as they lose a ton of them & are still a step ahead.

                      Continued success = who's running the ship, people who know how to adapt & know how to change what's not working. People who's message doesn't get old.

                      Robbo isn't one of those people anymore.
                      You still have to assemble a squad of players good enough to compete and be a chance of winning a comp each year—Dragons obviously did, hence why they won 11 in a row. The players back then had to work full-time jobs as they would never be able to survive solely on their footy earnings.

                      Mmm, by your assumption, the other 16 clubs should sign totally new coaches then (not recycled ones), as none have been able to compete with Penrith these last 4 years at least, irrespective of what team they coached.

                      Currently they are looking at AI and quantum sensing in improving the performance and reducing injuries of players in team and individual sports.

                      Very few pitchers in MLB can throw a baseball 100 mph plus or a Bowler in Cricket bowl a ball at 100 mph plus -There is no use trying to get players to do something they or their bodies are not capable of doing so you need to work within the frameworks of what a player is capable of doing without them suffering long term injuries as a result.

                      I can't recall any bad press Coach Robinson has had from any current or former player that has questioned his ability as a coach, though.

                      I get the feeling you're getting itchy fingers and hoping the Roosters don't do well so you can jump on this site with the "I told you so and Coach Robbo must go" posts.

                      We all know you are not a Coach Robinson fan, and hopefully you will be able to contribute to other topics and not turn them into get rid of Coach Robinson agenda ones.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Bates View Post

                        Well I'm not surprised as you think Hutch is a freak.

                        How will you feel if we sign Brown?
                        The Mercurial Hutchinator gave it his best for the Roosters in 71 NRL games including suffering a serious injury—fractured ribs and a collapsed lung, which put him in the hospital 3 times with that collapsed lung.

                        Mrs Salvo was shocked to see what I think Brett Morris was doing in that leg movement on the Hutchinator, as they would sometimes do that manoeuvre for people that were winded.

                        The Hutchinator was not winded, though—such an injury could cause serious damage to the heart, liver, and spleen, for instance, as well as bleeding in the chest cavity.

                        Not sure why people see it as some sort of right to beat up on players on so many social media sites, noting the great Sunil Gavaskar's view that nothing is social on social media.

                        Why do people knock a bloke for something they could never do though - Are they Jealous because of their own inadequacies perhaps in any sport they attempted to play and or whatever field or profession that ply their trade in ?

                        Be interested to know the reasons

                        Already reported the Roosters are not interested in Brown and rightfully so - give the youngsters their time to shine

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by King Salvo View Post

                          You still have to assemble a squad of players good enough to compete and be a chance of winning a comp each year—Dragons obviously did, hence why they won 11 in a row. The players back then had to work full-time jobs as they would never be able to survive solely on their footy earnings.

                          Mmm, by your assumption, the other 16 clubs should sign totally new coaches then (not recycled ones), as none have been able to compete with Penrith these last 4 years at least, irrespective of what team they coached.

                          Currently they are looking at AI and quantum sensing in improving the performance and reducing injuries of players in team and individual sports.

                          Very few pitchers in MLB can throw a baseball 100 mph plus or a Bowler in Cricket bowl a ball at 100 mph plus -There is no use trying to get players to do something they or their bodies are not capable of doing so you need to work within the frameworks of what a player is capable of doing without them suffering long term injuries as a result.

                          I can't recall any bad press Coach Robinson has had from any current or former player that has questioned his ability as a coach, though.

                          I get the feeling you're getting itchy fingers and hoping the Roosters don't do well so you can jump on this site with the "I told you so and Coach Robbo must go" posts.

                          We all know you are not a Coach Robinson fan, and hopefully you will be able to contribute to other topics and not turn them into get rid of Coach Robinson agenda ones.
                          Why is one defiant Robbo critic in a sea of Robbo lovers an issue?

                          Truth hurts? Don't want to believe a Roosters legend coach is just an average one now?

                          It's glaringly obvious that Robbo is the issue.

                          I obviously was a giant Robbo fan in his hey day but guess what...things change sometimes for the worst like his coaching & my opinion of him now.

                          Unlike some I don't have blind love in mediocrity.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Eggspert View Post

                            Why is one defiant Robbo critic in a sea of Robbo lovers an issue?

                            Truth hurts? Don't want to believe a Roosters legend coach is just an average one now?

                            It's glaringly obvious that Robbo is the issue.

                            I obviously was a giant Robbo fan in his hey day but guess what...things change sometimes for the worst like his coaching & my opinion of him now.

                            Unlike some I don't have blind love in mediocrity.
                            I like Robbo however I get where you're coming from.

                            I've felt like shaking him through the TV screen in recent times and can't cop his interviews. I know fronting up to the media isn't easy but it feels like he's pissing in pockets these days.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Bates View Post

                              I like Robbo however I get where you're coming from.

                              I've felt like shaking him through the TV screen in recent times and can't cop his interviews. I know fronting up to the media isn't easy but it feels like he's pissing in pockets these days.
                              Bingo!

                              To be critical isnt necessarily to hate.
                              i dont hate him at all. I respect the mans achievements & what he's done for the club/fans.

                              But like everything in life there is a end date.

                              Robbo will never leave on his own accord. He will be pushed out which will be a shame for his legacy.



                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Eggspert View Post

                                The coaches role is definitely not overstated.

                                The last 3yrs or so we've largely kept the same team while Penrith/Melbourne have lost really good talent but continue to be streets ahead of the rest. Did the players do that themselves?

                                Tell me...why can Bellamy & Cleary the last 5yrs beat the Roosters 23 times out of 24 but Robbo can do it once?

                                You reckon coaching has anything to do with it?
                                I think both Bellamy and Cleary deserve credit but like I said you are over simplifying & over stating the credit that should go to these coaches.

                                To buy into your theory you would also have be to believe that overnight Cleary went from being a coach who couldn't win a premiership in 12 seasons to a coach who could would make 5 grand finals in a row and win 4 in a row. I think the more rational and logical conclusion is that Cleary has always been a good coach, with the difference being that he's just had a team and resources at his disposal over the last 5 years that have allowed him to compete for those premierships. That's all that's changed...

                                Even Wayne Bennett has struggled away from the resources of the Broncos to win premierships... doesn't make him a lesser coach. I'd rather judge the coach on their ability than their fortunate positions.

                                If you want to talk about credit and potential swap for Robinson then talk about Bellamy's ability to transform Melbourne's attack post Cameron Smith.

                                Talk about Cleary's transformation of the modern day forward pack and three-quarter line and how their rushing defence has revolutionsed modern day rugby league.

                                But geez it's so boring to just reduce it to x won more games/premierships/select random moment in time that's convenient for your argument.

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